Ultramarine Blue vs French Ultramarine Blue

[Bhavna]

What is the difference between Ultramarine Blue and French Ultramarine Blue ?
I am not able to find the  French Ultramarine Blue in Utrecht store near to my house. they have only Ultramarine Blue(Winsor & Newton Artists' Acrylic Color, Ultramarine Blue). I also show Liquitex Heavy Body Acrylic Paint-Ultramarine Blue (Green Shade) and Liquitex Heavy Body Acrylic Paint -  Ultramarine Blue(Red Shade). So I am totally confused now.   

[dennis]

Pure Ultramarine blue comes from the mineral Lapis Lazuli (expensive).
Unfortunately I do not have the time right now to go into the intricacies of the make up of the various Ultramarine Blues but basically they are chemical (synthetic) compositions that represent the ultimate Blue. Some still have a portion of the actual  ground crystals in them and this is where the granulation comes from. For all practical purposes you may use any of them without any complications at all.

I personally very seldom worry about the various shades.

[Bhavna]

Thanks Dennis , I will go for Winsor & Newton -Ultramarine Blue 

[Annie.]

Here is some info.

I have noticed that my Ultramarine Blue (M. Graham) is much more 'purple' then the French Ultramarine that Nolan uses regularly in his lessons.   

M. Graham oil doesn't have French Ultramarine, neither does Golden acrylics.

French ultramarine looks like such a nicer blue to me.  So I guess my solution is to get a tube of French Ultramarine from W&N.  Is this what you do?

[musika]

Details

Here are four swatches of ultramarines
1. M Graham Ultramarine
2. Daler Rowney Georgian French Ultramarine (The one Nolan has used)
3. Winsor and Newton French Ultramarine
4. Michael Harding Lapis Lazuli (genuine)

The first 3 are all the same pigment PB29
Chemical formula Na_8-10Al₆Si₆O₂₄S_2-4 or Na_6-8Al₆Si₆O₂₄S_2-4
The name French/Ultramarine has no difference - the difference is in how each company prepares it.
The Georgian is $3.39 for 38ml
The Harding is $81.56 for 40ml
(All prices and swatches from Dick Blick)

[Happychappy]

Wow, Ray, you are so clued up.  I am wanting to start Acrylic painting and I purchased the list that Nolan gave us. However, I could not find the French Ultramarine anywhere.  Fortunately, I went to Florida for two weeks and managed to obtain 2 tubes of Atelier French Ultramarine there.  So now, it is just a matter of starting from the beginning.  Thank you so much for all you do for us Ray.  You are so appreciated.   


Patricia

[MaryAnne Long]

Nice work, Ray.  Thanks for sharing.  I love this kind of experiment.  So helpful.


aloha

mea

[Annie.]

Thank you Ray, I only have M.Graham so could not compare.

I think I understand it. 
Pigment Blue number 29, an inorganic Al molecule but after that the cie can call it whatever they want.

This is probably why Co blue and cerulean blue are so similar, the are both inorganic PB28, i.e. Co molecule.

Thanks a million.  I will stop fretting about my blue.

[May lynn]

Dear Happychappy.

I was able to purchase all the Atelier paint and medium I use from Island Blue  here in
Canada.  I tried Golden open and was very disappointed with them..  Atelier has a good
range of colors and flow nicely.  They do now have a new product call Flow, but, it doesn't seem
to be available here.

Island Blue is in Victoria, BC,  has a website and ship promptly.  No Exchange rates to worry about.

I live a few hundred miles away and if I call them to place my order I receive it in my rural box in
less than 48 hrs.  Now that is service.  You can order online but, I prefer to make sure they have it in stock
first.    1-800-661-3332

 Check out the Chroma site you may find a distributor closer to home.
 Their site also have many excellent videos on how to use the product and a great color chart.

P.S.  the only colour I am missing is Viridian (Atelier doesn't make it)

I hope this helps!

May lynn

[May lynn]

Dear Ray;

I think Nolan is using the Atelier in his Acyclic paintings and
possibly  Daler Rowney  or ? in his Oils


May lynn

[musika]

That's right, May lynn.
My point is that Ultramarine and French ultramarine are just  names and each company's version will be a slightly different colour - even if they have the same name. If you don't like the colour of one company then compare swatches of PB29 from different companies and find one you like.
the Dick Blick website is great for this.

[dennis]

May Lynn, use Atalier Phthalo Green for Viridian

[Happychappy]

   May Lynn for your information which I shall make a note of for future reference.  I really appreciate all the input as I am just about to start out on Acrylics which I know absolutely nothing about but am interested to give it a go. I always feel safe with "watercolour" but feel the need to expand my range of mediums.  Thanks so much.


Patricia

[Val]

  Good on you Patricia! Best of luck, have fun! 

[Happychappy]

   Val.  I have purchased all my paints but now it is trying to find the time to put them to use. 


Patricia